Be Bop Wino Pages

Joan Selects - the complete Joan Selects Collection

Big Ten Inchers - 78rpm rips by El Enmascarado

Attention Mac Users!

Mac users have been experiencing problems in unpacking the WinRAR archives used on this blog. Two solutions have been suggested.

1. Use The Unarchiver - - see comments on Little Esther Bad Baad Girl post for details.

2. Use Keka - - see comments on Johnny Otis Presents post.

Wednesday 21 September 2016

Caveat emptor ... let the buyer beware

You may notice that there's something familiar about the above LP covers ... and there's also something different about them.

These covers originate from this blog and they all have a rather large and intrusive logo plastered across them:

I found all of the above albums for sale on the digital download section of Amazon. Material from this blog is not only for sale on that site but also turns up on Napster and streaming music services like Spotify and even iTunes.

A while back I became aware that the occasional home made compilation from this blog was turning up on commercial sites, either for streaming or downloading. "Jump & Jive On 78" turned up on Spotify, and El Enmascarado (who ripped the sides from shellac discs) and myself had a bit of a laugh about the spread of a download-for-free comp into the commercial world. 

It's maybe not so funny when you notice that an outfit called Git It Records claims they own the copyright on the collection. And it's even less funny when you find the same comp is being sold by Git It Records on Amazon.

Still, it was only an isolated incident, and little harm done. In fact I felt flattered to see my home made cover up there among genuine commercial releases.

Within the last few days I have discovered that the selling-on of albums from this blog for commercial gain is no longer an occasional occurrence. It is now happening regularly and systematically. Most of the albums I have posted in the last few months are being offered for sale by a company called TP4 Music.

I was on Spotify the other night, hoping to listen to some Mar-Keys tracks to help me decide whether or not to buy a CD, when I came across the Al Sears "Ride The D Train" album, which I had posted on Be Bop Wino last April 1st.

I was puzzled, as this is an album which has never been commercially available. It was actually a home made compilation made up to look like a Saxophonograph LP as an April Fool joke. Examination of the cover on Spotify showed that a large, ugly logo had been superimposed on the cover and the "Saxophonograph" label had been removed.

Further searches around Spotify uncovered more albums from this blog, all with the original issuing company logos removed and the TP4 logo superimposed. Google searches showed that more than 30 albums from this site are on various streaming services or are even being sold for download.

I also came across a post from the "Forgotten Masterpieces" blog (31st August) in which the blogmaster called out TP4 Music for selling albums from his blog. "Forgotten Masterpieces" specializes in 1950s and 1960s light orchestral pop (Semprini, Frank Chacksfield, Mantovani, etc) and big band music from the same era (Ray Anthony, Ted Heath, etc).

A search for TP4 Music in the digital music section of Amazon (UK branch) yields 4,175 results. That's 169 pages of mp3 albums for sale. The vast majority are recognizable as vintage 1950s / early 1960s LPs with that intrusive logo splashed across the front. Many are of the kind of music posted on "Forgotten Masterpieces", while others are jazz, r&b, exotica, pop, rock 'n' roll, and even early surf music.

I've looked through all the search results and I suspect that some of these albums may have been downloaded from blogs. I've also come to the conclusion that most of the music being sold by TP4 is probably at least 50 years old. In the UK music released in 1962 and before is in the public domain.

Some might say, "so what?" After all, when I upload music to Be Bop Wino it is "out there" on the web, and anything can be done with it. However, there are a few reasons why I'm feeling a bit fed up.

1. Selling these rips and scans runs contrary to the ethos of this blog. The music posted here is available for free. It is posted with the intention of raising interest in largely forgotten styles of music. I frequently try to steer readers towards legitimate commercial releases.

2. There is no commercial intent in this blog. It is advert free and I do not solicit donations. The contributors to this blog are here to "educate and entertain."

3. The mp3s posted on this blog are ripped from vinyl and shellac (often in not very good condition) by non-professionals using basic equipment. They are for home use and are not of a standard which is suitable for selling. Anyone paying for these mp3s would be justified in feeling that they were not getting value for their money.

Here's an example of that last point. Two mp3 downloads of Buster Brown and B. Brown - one from a commercial reissue company, Jasmine. The other taken from this blog:

Jasmine version - 28 tracks, sleevenotes, professional production. Cost = £6.49 for a download or £6.55 for the CD from Marketplace.

TP4 version taken from Be Bop Wino - 15 tracks, many ripped from crackly 45s by Joan, this blog's longest standing contributor. Amateur cover art by myself which took about 5 minutes to produce. Cost = £5.49.

It's no contest. The Jasmine CD (which was recommended on the Be Bop Wino post) wins by a mile, as does the Jasmine download. In this case the TP4 download looks like a ripoff. Caveat emptor.

The rips on Be Bop Wino were never intended to be used for commercial gain. They were not created to compete with music reissue companies, and are not of a commercial standard.

There is no link whatsoever between this blog and companies offering music from here for sale. This was done entirely without my knowledge or approval. If asked, I certainly would not have approved of the selling of any material from this blog.

At the moment I am undecided on whether I should continue to post albums. The fact that people are waiting to scoop up the music and use it to profit from the efforts of myself and other enthusiasts is a real joykiller. It takes the fun out of blogging and fun was the reason I started Be Bop Wino.


musicyoucan said...

Dear Be Bop Wino, you music blogroll is full of treasures. Each post is very documented and detailed and it is the reason I visit it quite on a daily basis. Really Thanks a lot for the huge time you are spent on it.

Rebecca said...

This blog is something else, LOVE IT, Thanks for share wonderful music, thanks thanks thanks !!!!

phipps11 said...

Please continue to post albums. You are performing a remarkable public service for fans of the music, no matter what the bad guys do.
thanks, Jon

Anonymous said...

love, love, love this blog...rapacious, unprincipled capitalism not so much. I am sorry about all this.

erasmus said...

thanks for this educational post. what is revealed here doesn't bode well for the future of great sites like this.

Leo said...

this is strange...

but man, your blog is awesome!
one of the best for sure!
thank you so much for the treasures!!!

1ram said...

Why can't we all love the music, and not the mu$ic.

Anonymous said...


Admittedly this is outrageous, but in a blogosphere where what is for sale and what is pirated, what is copyright and what is copyleft, has become indistinguishable to many less-than-ethical folks, "caveat emptor" may be all one can say.

For what it's worth, this blog has introduced me to a world of unheard music at a time when most of my usual listening left me cold. I appreciate your efforts to educate and entertain. I'm a richer old man for it. rs.

The In Crowd said...

Thanks for the heads-up, thanks for all your work, and big thanks for making fun a priority!

Anonymous said...

Difficult decision Be Bop, I'd prefer you carry on but feeling ripped off is not good.

I don't go to legitimate download sites as I get enough music from about five sites.

Good luck deciding.

I too am anonymous.

Unknown said...

Dear BW,
Please don't stop! I am addicted to BBW -- grab all of the downloads and read all of the posts. When I find music I have to have in hard copy, I buy CDs or (when I can find the discs) vinyl. It's a bit depressing that this kind of ripoff is going on -- not a littl violative of the spirit of the blog.
Best, Sam

The Jackal said...

Dear Woodie

Sorry to hear about sad greedy gouge from you great work.
You've given those here for the joy of Jump blues and Rock history such an education.
Long may you run

Bob said...

Homo homini lupus est, alas, that the nature of men. The animal does not eat its own kind, but the man, yes.

KurtGS said...

Well what can I say, capitalism works this way. Some are always trying to benefit from someone elses work. I don't see what one can do about it. Just continue with your postings, the are much appreciated!

David Federman said...

No post(ing) mortems, please. Keep blogging. I solemnly swear never to make a penny from the sweat and shares of music-servants/savants like you. What you do for cultural survival deserves a medal of honor. Thanks.

Bill S. said...

Sorry to hear this. I make CDR's of some of these albums to listen to my car (I'm not really a computer person) and a few times I've burned a copy of a cdr for a friend who does not have a computer. For me, that's just spreading the music and extending the work of the blog. SELLING what you have shared is NOT ok. If someone wants to help get the music out there, that person should put a link to your blog on their blog and send traffic your way, so blues and r&B and roots-music lovers can listen and download as individuals. As we used to say way back when, "that's uncool." BILL S.

Chef JP said...

So sorry to hear of this situation. Your blog, along with a handful of others, are published by folks who celebrate the music and the wonderful artists who created the sounds. I think one reason you should continue is simply that your blog is a place where younger folks who may have never heard these artists will discover them and in turn, perhaps create their own music that will carry the sounds of these artists forward into the future.

Anonymous said...

I didn't know about your particular issue, but I can't say it's surprising, considering human nature and the state of the economy.

I'd fully understand if you quit outright. Blogging tunes must be it's own reward as I've heard of a lot of cases of blogs ripping each other off.

Regarding Spotify, I've heard it said that an ordinary private party can upload stuff to Spotify and make it available to anyone. Is that true?

Unknown said...

It's an tough quandry. I understand your frustration with being ripped off plus the fact that these are not 'remastered' but are being profited from while commercial releases of higher quality could be ignored. I also appreciate you & all the contributors work in making these labors of love available to an audience which would have no chance to hear most of this music. It's your call to keep posting or not, & I would never be angry towards you if you stopped although I would be disappointed that a source of special musical pleasure was closed.
Thank You for all that you have done to share rare & beautiful art with others.

spoofer12345 said...

hi bebop,these people who are doing this to you have no heart or soul.i have never commented before anywhere on blog sites. But i am sorry, this has to be said,to these money grabbing low lives who disrespect all music rights to your fantastic blog, that i treasure with all my heart and soul.I hope your websites fail and you get everything that comes to you, because what goes round, comes round.I have been on your blog now for the last so many years, and other respectable music enthusiast blog sites.i would never even think about doing anything that is so low and degrading.I hope things sort itself out for you,and im sure i speak for every genuine music enthusiast,that supports you,our full backing is with you.Again i am sorry for you


Bob Mac said...

Hi Woody,

I'm sorry to read about this situation which is pissing you off. I understand how you must feel but sure hope you do not cease posting on your fine and most interesting blog.

monkeeboy said...

Wow. Don't know how they get away with it and how it can be stopped. What a conundrum. You have a great blog and have been doing amazing work for a long time. I'd love to see you go so cuz you fill such a great niche but I can understand your frustration. Whatever you decide thanks for all you have done.

swboy said...

Making money on someone's nonprofit work. An ugly side of the "business" world. The people who really know and love [and buy] this music won't be fooled. I can understand why you'd want to quit, but hope you don't.

Crispy said...

This is a brilliant Blog that I visit often, I own many/most of the LPs you post so its a blast to dig them out again on my turntable- as well nice to have a ripped copy, and your writing is wonderful. It is sad that someone is taking your work and profiting. It must be said that most of these LPs were released in Europe without royalties at a time when many of these folks were still playing however. I once asked the great pianist Charles Brown to sign the World of Blues Pathe Marconi LP on the upper left of your collage. It was after a concert I produced. He had a few cuts on that at a time when his music was very hard to find. He turned to Dottie Ivory, "Look Dottie, another album I am playing on I did not know about"..I felt about about 6 inches tall, so I guess that bell has been rung, the creators of this music are mostly gone. That said, these opportunists should have their covers pulled, and if you love this music buy legitimate CDs as well as download, as someone has to pay folks who take time to dig out the tapes, clean them up and research & publish the music. You have a super blog I for one really enjoy it and am sorry I haven't commented more often.Thank you.

Ernie said...

Happened to me many a time, not sure how to counter it, you just have to try and get used to it. Some people have no scruples, but then if you look around at what some people think is OK to share, are you really surprised?

boogiewoody said...

OK guys - you got it. We'll keep on keepin' on. I didn't realize that the blog had such dedicated followers.

Thanks to everyone who has taken the trouble to comment on this post. Let me echo what Crispy says - don't just download, but buy CDs from the real reissue companies who do the research, locate the mastertapes and generally continue to put the music out there.

And Bill S. - I really enjoyed your story of burning CD-Rs for a friend without a computer. That's the way to spread the news that there's good rockin' tonight.

Thank you everyone - another post will appear this weekend.


Bob Mac said...

Thank you. I'm really pleased to hear that you'll continue posting great rockin' R&B/Blues for us.

malcee said...

Boogiewoody, don't hang up your rock n roll shoes

DrRay3 said...

Thanks for years of great posts. I consult you daily. You do a great service in keeping alive all this music.

Gerard Herzhaft said...

My blog had been ripped off and albums being sold on Amazon and such the same way. Sad and appaling ways of acting

Blulou said...

Well can't we do something to highlight this against these companies? Make buyers on these pages aware somehow? I love what you do!

Unknown said...

Boogiewoodie, you have all my sympathy..What these unscrupulous gangsters are doing is simply.... unbelievable,mindboggling.Making money of sub-par blog rip-offs, it's the world on his head...and then we (the blogs) are the bad guys? On top of that they claim copyright? I would like a list of groups involved in such practices: "Git it", "TP4music".. are there others? Some higher authority should investigate those vultures businesses,...customers who buy it are being cheated too. I see some visitors of our blog too here :) Keep up your great labor of love,my friend.
Thanks and Kudos to you!!Best Regards.

Anonymous said...

Your Dexter Gordon/Wardell Gray post of The Hunt in 2007 turned me into a jazz believer after a few dozen years of not having the will or desire to get into such things. Now I'm the proud owner of 10+ Mosaic jazz sets and a healthy collection of SHM-CD reprints of classic jazz albums. I'm proof that you're performing a service not just for music lovers, but for people making legitimate reprints and rereleases. I'm sorry you've had this experience with resellers, but thank you for all of your work through the years. You are appreciated.

boogiewoody said...

Again, thank you everyone for your comments. Sorry I've been slow to get back to posting - there are a couple of posts in the pipeline!

Maybe a blacklist of these "companies" could be compiled, but what to do with it? Perhaps warnings could be posted on the download services, but then I wonder how much business these "companies" actually do? And do bloggers want to risk attracting the wrong kind of attention?

I hadn't spotted anything of Gerard's on the TP4 Amazon pages but I think I spotted a couple of albums from The Blues Years.

I'm just going to carry on, though it will have to be bit less often than recently as the new academic term is about to start, and I'm taking up my studies again.

Thank you to the convert to Jazz - that's exactly the kind of message I always hope to get.


Anonymous said...

Hi Boogiewoodie,
Just discovered this post so i am a little late but of course i understand how you feel about this "stealin'" .
Glad to see it won't stop you from posting nice albums and compilations with great information .
I also hope that the visitors of our blogs will continue to buy Cd's from companies that are offering high quality sound and booklets with interesting information , photo's and discography ( For me Bear Family , Ace records , P-Vine , John Tefteller and a few others are doing great work that needs to be supported ) .
I have the feeling that vinyl rips are very useful information but also a motivation to buy the corresponding
Cd's because they often have bonus tracks and of course professional sound remastering .
And as i am here i wanted to ask you if you plan to post Sonny Boy Williamson - Chess Masters Vol.2 : i have a request for the Sonny Boy Williamson - Chess Masters series and already answered that Vol.1 is available on your blog (with the link from your post) I can post Vol.2 but only if you don't have that already in the pipeline :-)
Best regards .

boogiewoody said...

Hi Marc

Yes I agree with you about buying CDs. I ended up buying the Mercury Blues 'n' Rhythm Story boxset after I downloaded it from a blog!

I don't have Sonny Boy Williamson Chess Masters Volume 2, so please go ahead and post it. I'll download it for a listen.

Thanks for your support Marc, posting will resume here soon!


leeisme said...

I can only imagine how you must feel about this. The disappointment must be tremendous. It is very sad when a labor of love is twisted into something far less noble. Keep your spirit up.

koen said...

For several reasons I never put the soundfiles of my radio program on-line. You just gave me another reason.

Keep on posting Woody. People who pay for the music you post are the real losers, where you can get it for free with your elaborate comments.

Unknown said...

you are a life saver for me, floundering on crap pop , when i discovered your blog I was educated and became a fan of the era...The Ravens, early pre-rock'n'roll, r &b, this is the bomb! thank you for all the time and effort you have put in, and i have followed you for 3 years at least have so much knowledge to pass on. I was a Louis Jordan fan, but now with Calvin Boze, they sound like twins! I'm still waiting for more Nelson Alexnder ....he's so clever and jumps!thank you sir!

mingusal said...

Getting ripped off sucks. People profiting from the stolen work of others sucks. Having your own work, intended to be given to the world as a gift of your love for the art and the artists, turned into someone else's cynical profit center hurts. I can see why this would make you question your desire to continue.

But the music remains wonderful, as does your obvious love and respect for it. And your discerning work with this music remains among the very best in the world, and is a consistent joy to all of us who actually love this music too. Please keep up your fine work with music that deserves to be remembered and enjoyed. Hard as it is sometimes, please remain on the good, giving, joyful, and uncynical side of life.

Bruce said...

Deepest appreciation for all your efforts!! Thank You!
You have enriched my music awareness, and my collection incredibly.
Your hard work here, combined with your giving, sharing spirit, has blessed so many.
People are people... the good, the bad...and the ugly. Doubt this will ever change till God's new world.
I really regret what is happening with your rare collected works, shared for true friends and fans.
Try not to be dismayed by the lowest of the low that exists in people.
Press on my friend... to the higher calling. Keep pressing on.
See you tomorrow, and the next day... as always.

B._B. said...

What a vile situtation. Those creeps ought to be strung up. It's rigged, I tell ya. Fixed against the good guys.

Oops. Sorry, don't mean to sound too much like Donald J. Rump....

Anyway, they can take the music, but the BBW spirit will never be stolen away by those evil baddies.

Oh, and happy Hallowe'en.

Horrors. Those "P.D." cretins. Grr... Grrrowl... Sic the Wolfman on 'em.

Uncle Gil said...

Same thing for me... even the well-known on-line-shop Bim-Bam sells CD-R's from my home made comps and covers !
Records fairs, Internet... all is good for made money from the work of others. Bye Bye the fine idea of sharing his passion !
Keep the good work, Be Bop Wino !!!

boogiewoody said...

I'm surprised at Bim Bam doing that, Uncle Gil. I've occasionally shopped online and over the phone with that business. I wonder if someone else is passing on the CD-Rs to them?

Ah well, we keep on despite the disappointments.

B._B. said...

Another VICTIM of the "predator" PD purveyor pukes . . . !

The Unk has joined the convo (some serious stuff sadly stolen!):

Rocky Lane said...

It may be politically incorrect these days but there are people on this planet that need to be shot. The low-life's ripping you and others off for profit are some that should be shot now!

boogiewoody said...

Hi Rocky. I think you may have gone beyond "politically incorrect!" I would be content if they were to spend the next 20 years in a Turkish prison.